Need A Little Help I'm Off To A Rocky Start

Discussion in 'Pests and Plant Problems' started by Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 11, 2016.

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  1. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    It can't get it to save what I write, it shows in preview and then disappears upon posting.
     
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 14, 2016
    #21
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  2. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    More photos (removed)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 14, 2016
    #22
  3. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    The last one's (removed)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 14, 2016
    #23
  4. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    Yes there is a lot to my system, yes it is really compact... NO IT IS NOT FINISHED YET!!! And yes there is a good reason and purpose to every aspect and part of it.


    Yes that is just colored water by food coloring in the water NOTHING ELSE... as I wanted to show the power of the aeration of the water pump and the inline oxygen generator I built myself, which by those photos I'd say appears to work just fine!
     
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 14, 2016
    #24
  5. OldSmokey

    OldSmokey Registered Users

    Wow, that looks complicated. What advantage do you hope to see from this? What do you use an oxygen generator for?
     
    OldSmokey, Apr 14, 2016
    #25
  6. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    I came here to ask for help on a complex problem, and I've felt repeated cut down despite my best attempts to post the articles written by people with Ph.D's in front of their name who are the Directors of Hydroponics at a big company pushing the hydroponic industry forward, whom guys who are home growers are claiming don't know what they are talking about... I'm choosing to remove my posts from this site, and I've not a single desire to ever return here... I'm sorry that you have come here to read this, but it is a waste of your time and mine... and I am not going to be some place I am clearly not desired... I've got better things to do as I am sure others here do as well...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 14, 2016
    #26
  7. OldSmokey

    OldSmokey Registered Users

    Seems like we had similar ideas going into this game. But it didn't take too long for me to realize that the best I'd be able to do would be about like everybody else, using tried and true methods of growing. Lots and lots of folks have grown this plant with varying levels of success, using all sorts of methods. There was no real reason to have to reinvent the wheel. So I invested a massive amount of up-front time and effort into making my grow easy to deal with on a day to day basis. This was far more important to me than trying to achieve massive yields with potentially finicky growing methods. I went with passive hydroponics (Hempy buckets) and automated the feeding and draining to make things more convenient for me. This was after trying the Hempy buckets outdoors using manual feeding for a couple of grows to get familiar with the process.


    Part of my growing setup involves a reservoir to store my mixed nutes before they are dispensed into the Hempy buckets. (This is not a recirculated system.) The 6.5 gallon reservoir has two 2"x2"x6" air stones being fed by a linear air compressor of a size that would be appropriate in a pet store to aerate all the fish tanks. It can move serious air. But that wasn't the reason that I selected a pump like this. I got for its ability to pump air quietly, something my previous pump couldn't do. So now I have the ability to make the contents of my reservoir look like the inside of a washing machine. It works terrific as an aid to nute mixing, but I seriously question the need for it for "oxygenation". Right now it runs 10 minutes an hour, primarily because it drives the humidity up in the grow area.


    So here's a little air pump paradox: The organic people need an air pump to oxygenate their teas to promote bacterial growth. The hydro people use an air pump for their reservoir to prevent bacterial growth.


    OS
     
    OldSmokey, Apr 14, 2016
    #27
  8. nippie

    nippie preachin' and pimpin'

    hey, nice to meet you, yada yada yada


    Trying to figure out whats going on or what your issue is but honestly is kinda like finding a needle in a haystack.


    So can you explain in like one or two lines what your issue is, you have a lot of info which is good, but in this situation i think a lot of it's just back ground noise and is making the process harder than it needs to be.


    I have a couple questions that I'm not real clear on,


    how long have you actually been growing


    how long have you used that nutrient schedule


    but why vinegar?? I would switch that immediately if you are using that..proper ph down cost like $10


    also silt...i'm not seeing where this was asked about but seen in RR answer, are you talking about white rings and deposits on your gear and ressy?? if so, that's normal, like absolutely normal...elbow grease once a week during changes will stop that


    and i honestly think you are over thinking the issue....less is sometimes more, a couple or larger air pump will put more oxygen in the water than you'll ever need, h2o2 will add to this....


    you have a neat looking system, but I'm not sure if that's actually going to be to your advantage....but once again i'm not clear on what the problem is
     
    nippie, Apr 14, 2016
    #28
  9. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    I came here to ask for help on a complex problem, and I've felt repeated cut down despite my best attempts to post the articles written by people with Ph.D's in front of their name who are the Directors of Hydroponics at a big company pushing the hydroponic industry forward, whom guys who are home growers are claiming don't know what they are talking about... I'm choosing to remove my posts from this site, and I've not a single desire to ever return here... I'm sorry that you have come here to read this, but it is a waste of your time and mine... and I am not going to be some place I am clearly not desired... I've got better things to do as I am sure others here do as well...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 15, 2016
    #29
  10. OldSmokey

    OldSmokey Registered Users

    Cool. I like to experiment too. But when just the cost of the electricity to get my three plants from clones to jars is close to five hundred bucks, I have a fair amount at stake and have to minimize the possibility of failure, something that's happened a couple of times before. So for now, my experimenting has to be limited to those things that seem to have proven track records.


    Good luck with your quest.


    OS
     
    OldSmokey, Apr 15, 2016
    #30
  11. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    I came here to ask for help on a complex problem, and I've felt repeated cut down despite my best attempts to post the articles written by people with Ph.D's in front of their name who are the Directors of Hydroponics at a big company pushing the hydroponic industry forward, whom guys who are home growers are claiming don't know what they are talking about... I'm choosing to remove my posts from this site, and I've not a single desire to ever return here... I'm sorry that you have come here to read this, but it is a waste of your time and mine... and I am not going to be some place I am clearly not desired... I've got better things to do as I am sure others here do as well...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 15, 2016
    #31
  12. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    I came here to ask for help on a complex problem, and I've felt repeated cut down despite my best attempts to post the articles written by people with Ph.D's in front of their name who are the Directors of Hydroponics at a big company pushing the hydroponic industry forward, whom guys who are home growers are claiming don't know what they are talking about... I'm choosing to remove my posts from this site, and I've not a single desire to ever return here... I'm sorry that you have come here to read this, but it is a waste of your time and mine... and I am not going to be some place I am clearly not desired... I've got better things to do as I am sure others here do as well...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 15, 2016
    #32
  13. nippie

    nippie preachin' and pimpin'

    I'm not really sure what to say....but you are so over thinking issues i don't know where to begin.


    you solve the acid problem but simply adding your down before your nutes, literally that easy. But you don't even have to do that, dilute it in a cup of water then add, and still you don't even have to do that, I can attest that people have just squirted that shit in there and stirred it and had great plants and harvests. you are more likely to run to into trouble with vinegar than ph down...but vinegar is an acid anyways. i don't understand your don't add acid to water statement, you don't add ph down straight to nutes because of the concentration level and if you have organic nutes the ph level may kill or change them


    And your ph should be stable anyways, i for the life of me don't understand what you are saying and i've got a few harvests under my belt using virtually every hydro set up imaginable. Thus my question about nutes and how long, I can literally add my up or down prior to nutes with numerous formulas and be tits on from experience and iif you let that bucket sit there it will be the same exact ph days later, if you ph is changing drastically you have real issues


    Your ph changes as you ppms change, it should slowly drift up during the week but not at a rate that you should have to add up or down to it.....just when you add back water. And you are saying something about adding back water and flushes, if you are not doing this then your plants are healthy. You have some evaporation during a given week, but it's your plants eating....you can't have 50 gallons on sunday and expect the following saturday to have 50 gallons.


    Thats the point of checking ppms which isn't even really needed but hey.....say you start off monday at 1000, and friday you are at 1200....it's because the plants are taking up more water than nutes, or vice versa if your ppm goes down then your plants are happy and eating


    And the oxy thing, I don't think you understand why you do this. Oxygen does a couple things, it gives the plants roots oxy but it also controls bacteria. I'm not sure what you think else it does or increasing levels of dissolved oxygen to XXX levels etc. Literally on a flood table the act of draining and the water dropping back into the ressy is enough to add oxy back to the plant, no need for anything else except maybe a few mls of h2o2 to help with bacteria if you are running sterile which i would highly recommend to anyone starting in hydro. But dissolved oxygen has more to do with water temp than anything.


    Like i said earlier, I'm not even sure what you think your problem is.....but i can point to numerous things that will cause problems in my eyes


    I would take old smokeys advice
     
    nippie, Apr 15, 2016
    #33
  14. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    I came here to ask for help on a complex problem, and I've felt repeated cut down despite my best attempts to post the articles written by people with Ph.D's in front of their name who are the Directors of Hydroponics at a big company pushing the hydroponic industry forward, whom guys who are home growers are claiming don't know what they are talking about... I'm choosing to remove my posts from this site, and I've not a single desire to ever return here... I'm sorry that you have come here to read this, but it is a waste of your time and mine... and I am not going to be some place I am clearly not desired... I've got better things to do as I am sure others here do as well...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 16, 2016
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 15, 2016
    #34
  15. OldSmokey

    OldSmokey Registered Users

    Sounds really impressive. And yet very far-fetched. But that's how progress seems to take place. So, put your theories into practice and let's see how things go.
     
    OldSmokey, Apr 15, 2016
    #35
  16. nippie

    nippie preachin' and pimpin'

    well, all i know is what I know...I did let my wife read your response and she laughed also..


    but I've used growstone numerous times, when i say numerous prob for a few years in both hempys and tables under everything from t5s, led, and thousands upon thousands of watts of hps. both sizes, small ones are better in hempys than hydro cuz the little bastards float and clog lines


    yes, rinse em before you use them, and first ressy change you get a little bit of shit in there but nothing after that, in hempys i don't even rinse em that well


    but for the life of me, are you saying that growstones dissolve in water? that's the only way your theory could work, if water actually broke them down. But I would find that extremely hard to believe because i've filled drainage ditches with them and they still are there....that silt is just dust from manufacturing and transport etc


    and what does the vinegar do??? I know people that use it to break down salts and build up but never in all my years doing this heard it used in that manner
     
    nippie, Apr 15, 2016
    #36
  17. OldSmokey

    OldSmokey Registered Users

    I guess I hadn't realized that you re-posted the two that you deleted and didn't see them until now. A couple things...


    There are RO units designed to make drinking water. They use an extra cartridge at the end that puts minerals back into the water so that it tastes good. If your RO setup has this cartridge, either remove it or tap into the RO unit ahead of this cartridge to get your water. Then you can use cal/mag properly without interference from green sand.


    "ALWAYS ADD ACID TO WATER - NEVER ADD ACID TO WATER!" Huh? (I know where you were going with this, as someone who added a couple of drops of water to a small beaker of concentrated sulfuric acid during an unrelated experiment. That wan't pretty.) As for how this might apply to a grow, it really doesn't. When I make nutes, I start off with adding H2O2 and an Epsom Salt solution to my tank of de-chlorinated (and hard) tap water, then the various nutes in the proper order that the directions on the nutes dictate, followed by pH down to get the pH right. It takes about 15 minutes or so to get the pH stable at 5.8. BTW, they also make nitric acid pH down, but I've never used it.


    Is there any possibility that the Growstones were physically damaged by the direct application of full strength pH down? (I don't use 'em, so I don't know.)


    How about that filter that you (and only you) are using? What are the consequences to your system when it plugs up?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 15, 2016
    OldSmokey, Apr 15, 2016
    #37
  18. Sad Piggy_Banks

    Sad Piggy_Banks New Member

    Seriously where in the hell do you get half of this half-baked crap you are claiming I am saying??? You use Growstones, great... but if you actually took the time to see what I wrote on how I treated the Growstones when I "rinsed and pH'd them" you'd see I took straight pH Down and I dumped about a good portion directly on top of the Growstones, and then filled the 5-gallon bucket(s) full of 950-ppm high calcium tap water which was were my problems began for me... So please tell me in your experience have you ever done that with them? Do you have 950-ppm tap water... I mean seriously people complain its hard water at 200-300 ppm... I'm over 3-4 times that in hard water... When you bought Growstones did you get the paper bag (old process) or the plastic bag (new one's)... I got both and I combined mine together not knowing the difference, which by the way maybe you will know how they changed the process between the old process and the new process because it took me a couple of weeks of tracking someone down who could finally answer that for me, because its my understanding they changed the process of how they make them something to do with whatever the "foaming agent(s)" are, and I don't even remember all the details to that off hand and truthfully I am not even going to go try to find it.


    Never have I ever claimed they dissolve in water... My statement if you took the time to read it tried to point out to the fact that to whatever degree that silty-sand calcium from the process of making them that I never obviously did a good job of getting out of them because of how I rinsed and cleaned them... thus that calcium exists in the Growstones from the process of making them, because they use it in combination with something or another to make it foam up to create all those little tiny holes... Because of the drip system I am using those Growstones are not soaking or taking a bath to speed up the process of getting them to let go of all that calcium and I can't do that right now because they have plants growing in them... Which leaves me with having to run a flush again and bathe them in a just plain 6.5 RO Water and then here in an hour I'll be running a flushing agent and dumping the water... The idea is simple... bathe the Growstones in nothing but RO Water and then later a flushing agent in the hope, goal and belief that it will loosen up the rest of that calcium which has been hiding and lurking in the system causing me problems. I seriously can't for the life of me figure out how you can twist something as simple as flushing them to remove the crap hiding in them whether it is pH Down, calcium from the process of making them or whatever other hard tap water residue that hide whatever up in there... All I know is that the ppm's jumped over 300+ ppm's and the only thing I know I did was to turn on the water supply to bath four 5-gallon cloth Geo Pots holding the Growstones and plants...


    If you could explain to me how 30-gallons of water suddenly jumps 300+ ppm's when its just straight RO Water, nothing else and the system ran for 15-minutes to mix everything first to ensure only the Growstones and plants were not getting bathed in the water recirculation... Believe me I'd love to hear your thoughts and reasoning's for it... But as for mine, all I know is that either the Growstones caused it or the plants did and caused the 300+ ppm jump in literally 2-minutes!


    Equally I never stated, said, or made any assumptions that Vinegar, be it White or Apple Cider was breaking down salts or whatever else... All I am aware of the White Vinegar of doing is lowering the pH level which takes a lot more of it than pH Down might I add... Why am I not using pH Down? Because as I pointed out from the article written by a man who is a professional hydroponic scientist and the director of some big company... (yes I really looked it up so I knew for 100% certainly) says that as I stated previously that when pH Down mixes with certain types of calcium it causes a chemical reaction which changes the type of calcium. Now if you took the time to look up that article you will learn there are three main types of calcium used when growing plants and sold in most gardening stores because each one has its place. Just like if you take a Part A & Part B fertilizer and combine them together (WITHOUT WATER) you will cause a chemical reaction between those two and you will lock out the calcium between the two Parts (A & B) because of that same exact chemical reaction. Only I managed to do it by mixing straight pH Down with just Growstones... which by the way Growstones absorb liquids right? So when I poured straight pH Down over dry Growstones with nothing else in there and the last bucket would have taken me (I'm guessing here) 1-hour in which to fill... so for ONE ENTIRE HOUR lets say the brand new Growstones sat soaking up straight pH Down, then I added water and after it was all said and done dumped them straight into my system... Do you think the pH Down was diluted once the Growstones absorbed it to either its fill or until they got filled up on 950-ppm water? In either case straight pH Down mixing with serious levels of straight Calcium.. and as I showed doing such caused a chemical reaction which in turn led to other events...


    All I am now doing is trying to unlock the Calcium still hiding in the Growstones, by not using pH Down the idea is to not create another problem as I am seriously trying to flush out those Growstones... You and everyone else can stand there and point out Vinegar isn't as stable as pH Down in a hydro system and you'd be right... That is the whole point... I am mixing Organic Vinegar with Organic Calcium, Organic Nutrients (Fox Farm) and trying to flush all that out to just have Growstones filled up with RO Water and nothing else in the entire system... then flush... and start all over... thus fixing my problem... I mean seriously how hard is it to grasp the basic concepts of what I am saying... I am not using "B4" to mean "Before" I not only am doing my best to use proper English, but I have backed it up in details, facts, articles, information, etc... and still I'm being quoted as saying crap which never came out of my mouth in any way, shape of form.
     
    Sad Piggy_Banks, Apr 15, 2016
    #38
  19. nippie

    nippie preachin' and pimpin'

    look, I'll be honest with you, I'm hammered....took the kids fishing today etc.....but I'm not getting into a pissing contest because everyone here will tell you, spec mods and admin my shit drags the floor when i walk


    my purpose is to make others not repeat mistakes if you want to, by all means, but i wont let beginners coming here do it


    You need to rethink your entire system, best case chelated cal will help you, but youre looking for boogie man that doesnt exist


    you're not doing it right in the beginning, your nutes are way off, so I'm asking on behalf of mods and admin, put or shut up,,,but you/re you not going to abuse what we have here.


    If you have true questions and want to learn we will teach you, but I won't sit back and let you misdiresct people....aint going to happen....its just not, lets come to agreement so everyone is happy


    so frankly I am asking you to start over, please....we teach others here......for the love of the gods don't make me be a dick.....I really am trying to help you but if you try to act like you know more than me I will embarrass you, like ive said, i done this longer than you
     
    nippie, Apr 15, 2016
    #39
  20. blazerwill420

    blazerwill420 Fuck AUMA

    I was sitting on my hands. I tried, I really did. Poop, is that you?
     
    blazerwill420, Apr 15, 2016
    #40
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