Trayvon Martin - Zimmerman Trail

See that's what you guys are missing though....in FL if someone punches you then you can shoot, no duty to retreat if you are hit first. Everything shows that the kids was the aggressor, Zimmerman was a fat fuck thinking he was making his community safer....he prob should have just taken his ass whoopin...but legally he doesn't have to and can and did shoot the guy

 

I actually agree with a lot of this....but I'm speaking legally he's not guilty.


2nd Degree murder?? You think what Zimm did was 2nd degree murder???? Manslaughter maybe, in my state it would be manslaughter...but 2nd degree, cmon man


Just like legally he had the right to carry a gun. Fuck CC read the papers man. People get more than just the shit kicked out of them


http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/6-ohio-teens-arrested-beating-man-unconscious-article-1.1136965


You that big of a bad ass you think people deserve that for asking what the fuck you doing in their neighborhood? Thats all Zimm did...say hey the kid aint from around here. You telling me this NEVER happened to you as a kid?


You know it did, ever kid that grew up in the burbs near major cities prob has. You never snuck out of 1-2 AM at about 13/14 y/o with some friends and had someone ask you WTF are you doing? Most of the time you run because you think you are in trouble, you're scared either parents or cops...so you run.


NEVER did I once think about fighting someone....NEVER, I ran like all my friends did (usually laughing running through back yards) from people.


Are you saying this never happened to you??? NEVER?!?!?!?!?


Ambushing someone NEVER crossed my mind, EVER in those cases.


Now, if you run up on me my first thought isn't going to be to fight, it's going to be "what the fuck is your problem" and "fuck off"...someone takes it further then I'm having fun

 

Everyone has,or should have,the right to defend themselves. But self defence has to be proportionate to the level of danger and violence your being exposed too. If a kids armed and coming at you then fight fire with fire. Over here a jury WILL convict you if you used beyond reasonable force or proportionate force. It usually boils down to fight or flee.I'll let the Jury decide on the evidence.:2c:

 

I dont get this mentality. Not you specifically nippie ,just the whole American Gun Culture thing. Its like the cops with the dog. Why not just kick the shit out the dog and at least it lives? Same with the above statement. If someone sucker punches you then you either get a sore face or you get up and give them a sore face. Death shouldnt come into it. Im no prude on this shit,no neo nazi liberal either. Punches are punches,should never need combated by lethal force. This is where the whole Gun thing loses its way. I understand guns are for defence and what not. But when you have citizens thinking its actually OK to shoot someone for PUNCHING you.Then thats where shit gets fucked up. Iv been suckered punched in my life a few times,hit with bottles from behind. If i dont fuck them up there and then then i will,just give me time. Im never gonna use lethal force for a dented pride though. Guns should only be used to combat life threatning situations. Sucker puches and a sore face dont really fit the bill. Shooting someone for punching them is disproporionate response to the threat and danger posed. What this case should boil down to is : Did Zimmerman have any chance to flee,if he did then he took a mans life for a dented pride and some over eager suspicion. If he couldnt flee then it boils down to whether he GENUINELY felt his life was in danger of ending during the fracas.


With my shit i couldnt flee,in fact i ended up cornered in my own house. Outnumbered and outgunned. No where to run,too much to protect and all while being potentially murdered with weapons. In that case your justified to grab something to defend yourself. But i STILL had to go to court and explain my actions,justify them and set the scene for a Jury. I dont believe this case is Murder. Unintentional killing which where i come from is Culpable Homicide.... or manslaughter as they call it in England. He used excessive force that wasnt proportionate to the danger posed. Hes gonna have a tough battle to justify his actions. If he walks then hes learned a valuable lesson in life,if he doesnt walk then a Jury have convited him of Murder by mainstream media. Its not murder. You gotta have evil intent for murder. If you happen to kill someone in a struggle then at the worst its unintentional killing. Thats my take on it,naturally

 

He did call the cops though didnt he,and they told him to back off and stand down? Id have thought in a Juries mind that wouldnt go down well. I doubt he had evil intent to murder though. Just too big for his boots and when challenged he was under the kosh,panicked and unintentionally killed the kid. Manslaughter yes,murder no:2c: Again though,the jury are the best infomred to decide and i'll respect their decision either way:jj:

 

HE did have a place confronting him...it was his neighborhood and he was part of the watch. Zimmerman did nothing illegal, Trayvon took it to the next level


Following someone is not against the law, spec when the houses in your hood are getting robbed, if Trayvon was respectful he'd be alive. You can't just jump on someone because you want to...ask Trayvon. I guess the biggest lesson out of all this is "don't bring skittles to a gun fight"....that and don't be such a punk and try to beat the shit out someone because "your so gangsta"


I totally agree that Zimmerman is a pussy though, if you carry a gun, you'd better be able to defend yourself without it....you never shoot first, unless you actually think your life is in danger


TA..I'll pm you in a bit, have some work to do, but can explain my thoughts on why you are wrong...maybe just a culture thing though

 

TA...the laws are different in FL.


NO DUTY TO RETREAT....that means don't fuck with people. if you do then you got shot...old west style, you know. I'm saying legally, he aint guilty of shit. He obeyed the law, the law could be wrong, but he obeyed what they law was at that time.


I totally think he overreacted just because I don't think he's telling the truth. I think he confronted TM like a hard ass and got beat up, but that's the hole thing, legally once he got beat up he could shoot...that's the law. As long as no one can prove he started the fight.


Following and all that shit is extreme, but sometimes it's needed. I was a little punk once, so were many of my friends. We never did shit like this, but I did some vandalism as a teen cause most did, you know? Didn't deserve to get shot for what I did, but hey I ran.....TM didn't. TM wanted the fight as much as Zimm. Don't think he didn't


But my state has castle law not FL, FL you can shoot over anything...as long as you say "i was scared that I would get hurt (bodily harm)"....castle law is, you have a duty to retreat to your home, if in your home, shoot....I can legally shoot someone for carjacking me or my wife in my state. If they are carjacking a friend who's car I am in, I would go to jail for shooting because I have a duty to retreat. Make sense??? To me it doesn't, but it's the law and we are a nation of laws

 

If he had genuine fear for his life and if the Jury believe he had genuine fear for his life then he might walk. On the other hand a lot of that Jury are gonna be thinking "this wouldnt have happened if he just stood down like 911 told him too".Its a tricky one,can never tell with a Jury. Please tell me the guy gave evidence to defend himself

 

People are beat to death everyday...personally I think its a worse way of dying then getting shot.


http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-20


and that's not even the standard....great bodily harm is. That means if you have to go to hospital, or think you will have to go to hospital you can protect yourself.


I have a question for you guys...what if Zimmerman was a woman? Would TM still be just protecting himself, would he be the scared little kid still? Do you tihnk it's justified to beat women that are neighborhood watch?

 

Or what if Zimmerman was Gay,what if TM was a single parent?:tvlaugh: Just thought we could maybe merge the two threads in one go here


Yeah but its not a woman,and to be fair a woman would likely have did what 911 told her to do and stand down and simply observe. A woman wouldnt have put herself in that position because there wasnt any crime being committed,there wasnt any clear and present danger. Put simply,this would NOT have happened if Zimmerman hadnt tried to be the badass supercop. This wouldnt have happened if he had stood down like the 911 handlers ordered him to do. Having said that,hes not a murderer and it wasnt murder. For me worst case scenario for him should be some kind of reduced plea manslaughter charge. Its never a murder. If a guy follows me,then pulls up out a car and hes armed your damn right im gonna hit him first. If TM was still alive he'd be telling a court how Zimmerman put him into a state of fear and alarm by following him armed with a gun. The fact he was told by LEO to stand down is what i think could POSSIBLY fuck him in the end. All the same i hope he doesnt cop a murder cos lets be honest,the guys not that bright but hes no evil murderer.Just another dubass with a gun who cant handle his business properly:2c: Whens the verdict nippie? And DID ZIMMERMAN DEFEND HIMSELF FROM THE DOCK? If not then that never looks good to a jury either:jj:

 

How did TM know he was armed? And you don't think he'd run if he knew he was armed? Or is TM just super billy badass that can kick the shit out of someone carrying a gun and take it from him like Chuck Norris?


You think Zimm had a gun on Martin and TM beat his ass? Really? Makes no sense and doesn't fit the facts. Zimm was on his back and fired into TM's chest as TM was on top of him....that's a fact, evidence backs this up.


Also Zimm has said many times that he got out to see which way he went and to give Police the street names of the corner he was at then was attacked walking back to car


To act like he was told not to follow then chased the kid is simply not true, he did not follow after being told, just got his bearings. And they never ordered him to do anything...they said "we don't need you to do that"...it's a suggestion because if they said can you tell us where he is going, then Zimm gets hurt someone is getting sued.


Jury should get case this afternoon

 

I dont know all the facts. I started following this case but iv been to busy following the James Whitey Bulger case among others. I'll maybe have a wee read up on it but all im saying is,and remember i dont believe this guy is a murderer,theres a few things that could really go against him with this Jury. Theres also a few things that could go for him.Be interesting to see Florida Jury take on all this. Theres just summit disturbing about the fact that he started following a guy for NO LEGITIMATE reason and the guy ends up dead. I think thats gonna go against him. I think Zimmerman will walk but if this was two white guys then he would go to jail IMO. If TM was a woman then Zimmerman would be getting life but thats an invalid argument. All im saying is its shifty,but it ISNT murder. Unintentional killing at worst. Again though it IS a cultural thing cos over here we are obliged to retreat and flee in anyway we can.If we cant then fair enough but if the situation came about because of something we were doing.....then your fucked! All that bullshit with me,if ANY of it had been because i had instigated any shit then i wouldnt be posting here right now. Different cultures. I hope he gets a not guilty cos theres people who do need new TV's out there:tvlaugh: